Guidelines for this forum

[pencilhead]

What are the guidelines for this forum?

Anyone disagreeing with rick.ca has their posts removed....

[rick.ca]

No. I welcome disagreement. I'll even disagree with things I agree with in order to stimulate discussion. My responses to posts about problems the program often include suggestions of alternate methods that might alleviate the problem. Those to posts about feature suggestions often include the same sort of advice, along with my own ideas about how the program might be modified or a new feature implemented. I believe even great ideas are easier and more effectively implemented if there has been a thoughful discussion about them ahead of time. The idea the lack of my whole-hearted agreement means I do not understand or I am disrespectful of the poster is ludicrous. The fact that I respond the way I do demonstrates the opposite.

Posts of pure negativity, personal attacks and temper tantrums will be removed.

We haven't needed any formal guidelines thus far. I don't think it should be necessary. Everyone, including the developer, is here to engage in a hobby—something they do for fun, recreation and enjoyment. If we can remember that, and be respectful of others, there should be no need for guidelines.

[patch]

What are the guidelines for this forum?

Anyone disagreeing with rick.ca has their posts removed....

I have not had problem with my post removed here yet but rick is very active and rather strong minded which can make it difficult to suggest a view different to his.
I tend to just give up, and I suspect others do the same which I suspect reduces the breath of opinions expressed here.

Of course on balance rick contributes a lot to this forum & is generally positive & appreciated.

[rick.ca]

I have not had problem with my post removed here yet but rick is very active and rather strong minded which can make it difficult to suggest a view different to his. I tend to just give up, and I suspect others do the same which I suspect reduces the breath of opinions expressed here.

Believe it or not, I'm aware of, and concerned this phenomenon. Even I take care to not be "strong minded," just having a ready answer to a question or an opinion about something can be intimidating to some. I'm not sure what to do about this. I sometimes try to leave it up to others to respond to posts, but it's usually pretty quiet around here and I find it difficult to leave posts unanswered. I'm also incapable of shying away from a good debate. Aside from doing my best to refrain from personal attack, I'm probably not even willing to do anything about that. I just don't believe that good software development—or any creative process—can result by a bunch of people with different perspectives and preferences presenting unopposed ideas.

So maybe all I can do is ask that you please don't "give up." It might also help all of us to remember most of what we're doing here is presenting a range of idea for nostra to choose from. Sometimes a contrary point-of-view helps by framing the issue—which makes a choice and the resulting action possible. That is, the original idea is saved from the dreaded "Things to do when I have nothing better to do" TODO list. Theoretically, that means we only need to debate until our views are expressed, not until the debate is "won."

So do I now hit "post" or is this just another demonstration of my annoying strong mindedness?

[darichman]

I just don't believe that good software development—or any creative process—can result by a bunch of people with different perspectives and preferences presenting unopposed ideas.

This is a really great point Discussion among people with different baselines, goals and agendas is inherently prone to disagreement and wounded feelings. Sometimes this can lead to domination by some personality types who hold strong opinions and withdrawal from those who feel intimidated or lack the assertiveness to properly put forward and defend their ideas.

What is important is that opposition should be undertaken with the goal of stimulating further discussion rather than stunting it. This sounds like common sense, but novice users and those who visit the board infrequently may be put off posting just because of the tone of the thread or their relative inexperience compared to the power users who often dominate such discussions. In the end I think the art of diplomacy is key from both parties - recognition of the positive aspects of an idea or suggestion with non-confrontational exposition of problems and drawbacks is more likely to promote further discussion than outright disagreement. It's not simply about backing up assertions with logic, either, but attempting to identify the use case and perspective of the person you happen to be disagreeing with.

I'm usually pretty sensitive about how I'm perceived by others and, like many people, sometimes take criticism or outright disagreement to heart. Sometimes we need to be thick-skinned though and recognise that if our perspective or suggestion isn't supported by someone, it probably just reflects different needs and use of the program and not personal hostility...

Rick is very active here and I think this has been largely beneficial for the program's development. Personally I've had a bunch of problems since I started using the program and he's solved or helped with the vast majority of them.

So yeah... let's all play, but play nice

So do I now hit "post" or is this just another demonstration of my annoying strong mindedness?

"Post" is always a good choice

[rick.ca]

"Post" is always a good choice

I sometime find "Delete" is too.

Thanks for your thoughtful and kind words.

I may even try to implement your advice, so skillfully veiled in a cloak of diplomacy.